The Connected Mom

Becky Harling (00:08.395)
Conversations. Sarah, sorry, I gotta stop a minute. It said we're having trouble accessing your video. Can you see me?

Sarah Wildman (00:17.773)
Yeah, it came on for a second and then turned off. Okay, sounds good.

Becky Harling (00:21.415)
All right, I'm going to just start the intro again. Welcome to the Connected Mom podcast where we have real conversations helping you to connect more deeply with God, more empathically with your fellow moms, and more intentionally with your child. I'm Becky Harling, your host, and I have with me today my amazing co-host, Sarah Wildman. Hey, Sarah.

Sarah Wildman (00:48.839)
Hi, Becky. So, I don't know that we've talked a lot about this with our personal lives, but I am a working mom and actually just in the last two months have taken on more work as my boys are in school. And the word balance.

comes up a lot as I consider how in the world do you do it all? And I told you ladies before we started recording, I had one friend that said, oh, I don't think there is balance in life. You just give up on that. But I'm not sure that that's true, Becky. So I'm so excited about this topic because I don't think I'm alone in contemplating what it means to be a balanced mom, worker, wife and friend, right?

Becky Harling (01:30.971)
Yeah. And I was sharing with you, Sarah, before this, that over the last month and a half, I have heard from so many moms saying, I don't know if I can do this. And I am trying to balance my family and my job expectations and my friendships and my church expectations.

Sarah Wildman (01:45.069)
Hmm.

Becky Harling (01:53.663)
They feel a little overwhelmed. And so I thought today we would bring in one of my favorite people, Lisa Grimes. Lisa is very accomplished. She has been a CEO. She is still the CEO of Thread Technologies. She's an interior decorator. She's like one of these people that's kind of like a jack of all trades, a CEO. She has a degree in pharmaceuticals, but she's also an interior decorator. I don't know.

Wrap your mind around that. Anyway, she is a business leader, a coach, a speaker. She is a mama of two grown boys. She is going to be a grandmother sometime in the next month. She's married and lives in Cary, North Carolina, and I just love her. So I know you're gonna love her too. So welcome, Lisa.

lisa (02:45.57)
Thank you ladies for having me. It is a pleasure to be with you all. Balance is something near and dear to my heart.

Becky Harling (02:54.351)
Yeah. And so you and a friend wrote, Remember Who You Are, Achieve Success, Create Balance, Experience Fulfillment. And you talk about achieving balance in that book. You were a CEO while you were raising your kids. Did you ever find it hard to find balance, Lisa?

lisa (03:15.894)
Oh, maybe once or twice, or at a thousand on the end of that? Absolutely.

Becky Harling (03:18.583)
Hahaha

Becky Harling (03:23.943)
Yeah, and so what did you discover in that? How did you figure it out?

lisa (03:29.638)
Well, it was what I like to call a lot of on-the-job training. I did not find a manual other than the Bible. And that is the best manual. It took a lot of prayer. It took a lot of figuring out how God had wired me to give me the passions He had given me, and then to create my priorities around those passions.

without feeling guilty and we can hopefully find room to talk about that later. It also meant learning to establish healthy boundaries. It meant learning to be present where I was. If I were at home with my kids it was being fully there. I think it was Jim Elliott that said wherever you are be all there. If I was at work, work. Learning to accept help and say

I need some help here, learning to outsource some responsibilities and learning to be a bit different from several of my colleagues. You know, I blocked time on my calendar from 5.30 or 6 when I walked in the door. People knew I was not going to respond to an email or answer the phone until after my kids were in bed. That was my time with them. And certainly, I mention it last but not least.

Sarah Wildman (04:50.828)
That's awesome. So you quote C.S. Lewis in the book, and I hope I say this correctly, that you can't get second things by putting them first. You get second things by putting first things first.

lisa (04:55.362)
having a very supportive husband who was willing to share the load and support my career.

Becky Harling (05:02.719)
Hmm.

Sarah Wildman (05:18.784)
Can you unpack that quote a little bit? What does that mean?

lisa (05:22.246)
Yeah, it means that if everything is a priority, then nothing is a priority. We can't give everything equal weight on our mile long to do list. We have to get in a rhythm of living out those priorities that I just mentioned because otherwise we're going to be in a habit of living out our emergencies. And as I think both of you ladies will agree.

Becky Harling (05:33.32)
Mm-hmm.

Becky Harling (05:48.551)
No, no, no.

lisa (05:51.042)
there's always an emergency that we can live out. So as long as we keep first things first, then we'll get the important things done, the most important things, and the rest will fall into place.

Becky Harling (06:05.031)
I love that so much, Lisa, because I do think sometimes in our culture, there's a temptation to make everything an emergency and to respond like that, but that's not even good for our bodies. So one of the things I know about you, Lisa, is that you also, in addition to having a biological son, have an adopted son. How did that change you as a full-time career woman, as a CEO, as a...

mother and as a person.

lisa (06:38.166)
Well, we could spend a long time here. I would say the Reader's Digest version is it flipped everything on its head. I wound up resigning my C-suite position because I felt that's what God had called me to do. When we returned from Russia with our son and took him for a physical and some other health issues, we also found out he was deaf and mute.

Becky Harling (06:47.039)
Mmm.

lisa (07:06.414)
And I realized that was not a job for a nanny. And God was calling me to step back from my career at that point. And I had so many people say, if you step away from what you've worked so hard for, you'll never get back in the C-suite. But I knew what God...

Becky Harling (07:06.451)
Hmm.

lisa (07:27.062)
had told me and my husband and I were in alignment. And I also know that God is always faithful. When we're obedient to Him, He is not going to disappoint. And guess what? Our son not only has normal hearing, he can talk nonstop on occasion. And I have been, and I don't say this in anything but to give God the glory, been recruited back into the C-suite. So there you have it.

Becky Harling (07:36.043)
Hmm.

Becky Harling (07:55.971)
Yeah. I think a lot of times people make statements like that. Oh, you'll never do this if you do that. And it's just, that's their thoughts, not necessarily God's thoughts, but I love that story. So thank you for sharing it. Yeah.

Sarah Wildman (08:10.999)
Can I ask one more question on that, Lisa?

and what you described, you talked about different people saying, oh, you'll never get back to this spot. What was your heart saying? Because I think sometimes we can have all those voices of other people, right? But you said, God, can you talk about that a little bit? Because I think that's so important as we think about what matters in balance.

lisa (08:33.67)
Well, I had to do some soul searching and realize that it was what to make sure that the word was confirming and my husband was confirming what we were hearing from God because I had put so many years into a career and I had worked hard to achieve goals and make it to the C-suite and so I

It was that tug of war. It was finding balance, if I can use that word there, to accept I could come to peace with myself if I never made it back to the C-suite, because I did not know at that point. There were multiple surgical procedures, and we did not know. It was miraculous that he developed.

normal hearing and speech, but for all I knew, I was never even going to attempt to go back into the C-suite. So it was a it was really just a time of saying, God, what's this season in my life? And I hope we can get to that in a little bit later in our discussion, but I think it was coming to peace with this is what God's saying now. And as I know both of you ladies know, he doesn't always give us the full

Becky Harling (09:24.66)
Hmm.

Becky Harling (09:37.844)
Mm.

lisa (09:52.214)
directions for the next hundred miles. For me it seems like it's not even a half a mile at the time, but he is always faithful, but it's that one step. So does that answer it for you, Sarah?

Becky Harling (09:52.883)
I mean, yes.

Sarah Wildman (10:06.143)
Yes it does, thank you.

Becky Harling (10:07.975)
Yeah, I love that. And, you know, Lisa, one of the illustrations that you, I've heard you say, and you also use in the book is this idea of juggling all the balls. You know, we've all seen advertisements of women trying to juggle plates, you know, and they're crashing and dropping around her. And, you know, our life in many ways involves juggling many different roles. Could you explain the balls?

the way you do in the book, because I think it's so profound and really helps clarify what's important.

lisa (10:44.814)
Sure. We do often get shown as juggling many balls and I think not only are we not juggling balls that are all the same size and shape, we're juggling all kinds of things that get thrown our way with the hope that we're never going to disappoint our audience. But the fact is we know it's going to happen. At some point.

Becky Harling (11:05.628)
Mmm.

lisa (11:11.586)
something's going to drop and we need to get okay with that. So I want to preface what I'm going to say is sometimes we need to choose the ball that needs to drop because it's okay. And I do have a couple of show and tells that I just want to put up here. I'm going to start with our crystal balls and you all can see this is, you ladies can see it's in a heart shape. And I will tell you that this is a Waterford

Becky Harling (11:22.975)
Hmm.

Becky Harling (11:28.151)
Oh, nice.

lisa (11:41.87)
crystal heart. This is the most valuable of anything that I am juggling. So I have to guard this furiously. If I were to drop this, it would take an immense amount of effort, even if I could put it back together. So I say all of that to say that for me, my crystal balls are my faith, my family, and my closest of friends.

Becky Harling (11:59.828)
Hmm.

Becky Harling (12:10.6)
Anyway.

lisa (12:11.798)
always keep this crystal ball in the air. Next, and the reason I called it a Waterford crystal ball is I have a glass ball. It's also in the shape of a heart because it too is of value to me and it is also going to be really hard to piece back together should I drop it. However, it isn't as valuable as Waterford crystal.

So again for me in this category come work and volunteering. And then I have the rubber balls. Rubber balls are having a clean house, having my drawers organized. Maybe it's making a homemade appetizer, but if I don't do it and I'm having company over, I can order pizza and life is going to be just fine because what happens with rubber balls?

Becky Harling (12:46.879)
Mm-hmm.

lisa (13:10.39)
they bounce right back. If I were with you, I could just drop it on the floor and I would pick it right back up and put it back into my juggling routine and you might not even know that it was gone. We also have plastic balls and those are the balls that in the grand scheme of things are not our top priority. If we drop them...

Becky Harling (13:22.579)
Hmm.

lisa (13:35.182)
they're not going to bounce right back. A couple of examples I'll give you would be like exercise for 30 minutes or more each day. Well, working full time as a CEO and being a mom and travel, well, sometimes it happened in the airport, but I did not always get to eat healthy, nor did I always work out for 30 minutes a day. And you know what? It didn't bounce back like the rubber ball.

but it didn't roll away and it didn't shatter. I could pick it right back up and say, okay, in this season, I really want to exercise and I really want to eat healthy. And then the last category of ball that I want to cover is the lead ball. These are things that we juggle, they're things we hold on to that we really.

Becky Harling (14:14.116)
Mm-hmm.

Becky Harling (14:22.207)
Mm.

lisa (14:28.318)
should drop and let them stay on the floor because they weigh us down. We have yes balls. We say yes too much. We have the ball of being perfect. I don't have lead balls because I don't want to touch lead but I'll just show you a few more of these. We have the comparison trap rock. We have the fear of missing out rock. We have

Becky Harling (14:50.059)
No...

lisa (14:58.254)
draining relationships, we have manipulation, we have the rock of false guilt, I have a whole basket of lead ball rocks that weigh us down and those are balls that we really need to drop and leave them there. I think it's also important just to mention that

There are different seasons in our lives. I'm an empty nester now, but as Becky mentioned, soon to be a grandmother. That will be yet the new season. And one thing I have learned is to accept that some of the balls will change. My faith and family and closest friends don't change. They're my crystal balls. But way back when, I had my work, and I would keep it as a crystal ball or try to.

I realize it isn't and it shouldn't have ever been. It is a glass ball now because it went to plastic when we adopted Eric and it sat there. But it has worked its way back up because it is a priority. And I think when we can focus on our priorities, let go of those lead balls that weigh us down, then we can take care of the things that matter most.

Becky Harling (16:19.746)
Mm.

Becky Harling (16:24.947)
I love the way you describe that Lisa, because I think visuals really help us figure out this work-life balance.

Sarah Wildman (16:33.564)
Absolutely. So can we talk about the lead ball a little bit more, Lisa? Do you have an example? Because I loved all those that you showed, you know, FOMO, perfection. Can you give us an example in your life of something you realized was a lead ball and how you were able to let that go?

lisa (16:52.678)
Oh, I think I could give a few. I think, well, I would say false guilt. I could, and I'm gonna, you know, I'm gonna actually switch. I could give you that. I'm gonna give you a big one that I didn't cover. Critical self-talk. How often do we go, oh.

Sarah Wildman (17:01.456)
Okay.

Becky Harling (17:10.94)
Oh, good.

lisa (17:15.034)
Man, if I had only said this when Sarah asked that question, that would have sounded so much better, but I gave a stupid answer. Oh my goodness, why did I say that? And we can play that tune until it gets embedded in our brains. But how often do we go, wow, Sarah just said that was a good answer. That spoke to her. Let me keep...

playing that for a little while. Wow, I did help somebody. God allowed me to help somebody. So getting rid of that stinking thinking, critical negative self-talk, and letting that be the lead ball that doesn't get picked back up has taken a lot of practice. And I wish I could say I never pick it back up, but I don't pick it up nearly as frequently as I used to.

Sarah Wildman (17:57.62)
Gotcha. So good. Okay. So, we're going to go ahead and get started. Okay. So, we're going to go ahead and get started. Okay. So, we're going to go ahead and get started. Okay. So, we're going to go ahead and get started. Okay. So, we're going to go ahead and get started. Okay.

Becky Harling (17:58.335)
Cough

Becky Harling (18:06.375)
It's a journey. I love that though, because I do think self-criticism impacts so many areas of our life. And especially for those of you that are trying to do this thing called parenting well, I can't tell you how many nights I laid in bed as a mom thinking, oh, I really blew that today and I should have done this or whatever, but that's not really helpful. If you need to apologize, but then move on.

lisa (18:36.878)
Well, right, because it's contagious. And if we're always apologizing, like, oh, honey, I'm so sorry, my flight was late and I missed your ball game, well, then our children are gonna absorb that instead of, wow, I'm so glad dad recorded your ball game today so we can sit down and watch it together because my crazy flight was late.

Becky Harling (18:52.683)
Hmm.

Becky Harling (19:01.475)
Mm. I love that. I love that. It's a different way of saying things. So Lisa, let's talk about our to-do lists. I mean, as I've talked with these moms and Sarah and I often joke because we're very similar in personality. You know, we love a good to-do list. We love to check off the boxes, you know, and there have been seasons in my life where the to-do list is completely unrealistic. I'm never going to get through all that in a day.

So how do we keep from just becoming overwhelmed with our own to-do lists?

lisa (19:39.338)
Um, that is a great question, and I remember our editor saying, did you really ever have a three-page to-do list, because we wrote about it in the book, and it was like, oh yeah, oh yeah, I love the book at all. Um, I would say my really quick answer is asking myself, will this matter tomorrow? That's a quick answer. The little more lengthy answer goes back to the C.S. Lewis

Becky Harling (20:03.064)
Hmm.

lisa (20:07.438)
quote that Sarah asked about on recognizing our priorities. And it helped me to get in the habit of just ranking a few of the items on my to-do list, like crystal ball, crystal ball, oh, rubber ball, and labeling them and then deciding if they're a priority, well then I need to handle them today. This will matter tomorrow. Otherwise, could I delegate it?

Could I trade it with a friend? Could I outsource it for hire? Could I postpone it? Or should I simply delete it? And I am happy to give a few examples if you ladies think we have time for a couple of those. Okay. Well, delegating. I made it a priority to teach our boys how to help pack their lunches by the time they were halfway through their first grade.

Becky Harling (20:49.139)
Yeah, we do.

lisa (21:03.81)
because I wanted to teach them about packing healthy meals, I wanted to help them be responsible, and it helped me to eliminate something that needed to be done that night. Trading, for example, I love to decorate for Christmas. It is really just like a passion, and I can say not all of my girlfriends feel that same way. And so at Christmas time,

trade going over and decorate their house and they cook dinner for my family. So that's just a simple way of trading of doing something that I love to do and them doing something that they love to do. Outsourcing for me particularly in the busiest of seasons was hiring someone to clean our home or do our grocery shopping and a lot of that now can be delivered to our front doors fortunately. And postponing

For me, I could get going with a good to-do list and it's like, oh, well Christmas is coming up soon. I could be adding stuff for that. Well, sometimes realizing they just need to be placed as a marker in my calendar to add at a more appropriate time when my to-do list isn't that long. And then deleting, this is like, well I really was hoping to send in homemade cupcakes for.

Becky Harling (22:23.601)
Mm.

lisa (22:30.498)
the school classroom for his birthday, I think I'm gonna run to the deli and just get a sheet cake because I really don't have time in accepting that I don't have time and not feeling guilty about not having time.

Becky Harling (22:31.423)
Thank you.

Becky Harling (22:39.23)
Yeah.

Becky Harling (22:48.525)
Oh. Mm-hmm.

Sarah Wildman (22:50.1)
Yes. And I think sometimes for me it's been helpful to say those things out loud to my husband. You know, when sometimes when you

voice it. It's like, well, you could go to the deli, Lisa. It's like, oh yeah. It's nice to have somebody to bounce that off of, right? Oh man. Yes, exactly. Exactly. So this is kind of a sensitive thing. So we'll step on it lightly. But in the church culture, there are parts that moms maybe feel guilt who are working outside of the home. I think, you know, there's often an ideal set that

lisa (23:08.362)
Right, some validation.

Becky Harling (23:10.571)
Hehehe

Sarah Wildman (23:29.416)
you aren't working. But as the economy continues to be nutso and women have callings on their life to pursue maybe some professional things, what encouragement do you have for moms who are trying to help provide for their families when maybe culture around them isn't as affirming?

lisa (23:53.006)
Well, Sarah, that is just sad, but it's so unfortunately true. I have lived it and have been put in uncomfortable situations because of it. I would say a few things that helped me were told in Psalm 139, we're all fearfully and wonderfully made. Paul tells us so many times in the New Testament that we're given different gifts, but we are

Becky Harling (24:21.85)
Mm-hmm.

lisa (24:23.226)
our gifts, whether we're in the home or out of the home or whether we're doing a combination of both in and out of the home. My belief is that it is between us and God and if we're married our spouse. But I think all too often we accept that false guilt and we find ourselves feeling like we're stuck between a rock and a rock.

Becky Harling (24:46.658)
Mm.

lisa (24:51.754)
in a hard place because we want to go and find encouragement for continuing to do what we feel called to do and in some church settings that encouragement is not there but we find that we feel judged by in other settings because we're not home with our children and so it really has been a passion of mine to mentor and coach women. That was a great question.

One of the reasons I launched the coaching business is to coach young women who feel called to use their gifts in the marketplace. I do believe it's a decision that needs to be made prayerfully and that we should not be double-minded. When we have heard from God, and again, if we're married, our spouse has confirmed it, then I believe we set out to do what God has called us to do with the unique gifts, skills.

and passions that he has given us and to do it with excellence. And when we feel the nudge to revisit it or perhaps work part-time or perhaps take a break or perhaps go to work outside the home and then come back, I think it's personal. But if we have sought God's answer, then we need to leave the guilt at the door when

Becky Harling (25:55.531)
Mm-hmm.

lisa (26:15.574)
We're leaving with our cupcakes like we said earlier. It's one of those, you know, just leave it back there and don't beat ourselves up for the way that God made us because he doesn't make mistakes.

Becky Harling (26:18.471)
I'm sorry.

Becky Harling (26:31.384)
I love that, Lisa. I have heard from so many women, really in the last two months, who have really felt guilt or shamed from the church in their past, and they need to work because their family is not cutting it financially. And I think it's important to realize...

that God doesn't give just one way to raise children. And He allows us, I mean, if it was that easy, we wouldn't need to get on our knees and ask for wisdom, right? And so God calls us to be moms who are getting on our knees, who continually go back to Him for wisdom for what our family needs and what our kids need or what our grandkids need, if that's the case.

So I loved your answer, Lisa. There's so much wisdom there. Okay, moving on, we believe here at the Connected Mom podcast that our connections with other moms are really important because they help us in the journey of motherhood. And you say also that girlfriends are essential. So why do you feel that way? And how do our girlfriends help keep us kind of on the right track?

lisa (27:50.098)
Yeah, well, I would say for me, and if my hubby were anywhere close by, I think I'd be getting two thumbs up, is girlfriends are important because I love my husband. We're close to celebrating 40 years of marriage, but he is not my girlfriend. And by having girlfriends, I am not expecting him to be...

Becky Harling (28:07.969)
Yep.

lisa (28:12.186)
my girlfriend, he does not want to go shopping with me because I want to find this white blouse that has these 42 different descriptions. He's like, white blouse, let's go. And I'm like, oh no, this is just the beginning. I can do that with girlfriends. I can gab for hours about nothing or we can go really, really deep. I can get another opinion. We can do so many things. And for me,

Becky Harling (28:24.476)
Yes.

lisa (28:40.294)
it is that other element of balance and wholeness and a different perspective because I realized in my career, kind of when the Lord was really teaching me about like my work is not a crystal ball, my work goes here, but friends need to be elevated because I do need some close girlfriends for fun and who will also challenge me and say, hey,

Becky Harling (28:55.972)
Mm-hmm.

lisa (29:08.098)
Are you getting a little out of balance here or hey, are you thinking that? But I think primarily it's so that I don't put girlfriend expectations on my husband.

Becky Harling (29:21.501)
I love the honesty in that answer.

Sarah Wildman (29:26.206)
Oh my gosh. Yes. So, I feel like this could be a whole other podcast, Lisa, because...

you probably are a kindred spirit when we talk about perfectionism, right? So we can look at all those crystal balls and even as a perfectionist, I'm thinking, oh, but I could still hold them all up. I think I could do it. You know, I mean, I think I see what she's saying, but I bet I, I won't let any of them bounce, but that's just not the truth. Right. And so could you talk to us a little bit about how perfectionism can be a roadblock and parenting?

in our careers, talk a little bit about that for us.

lisa (30:03.25)
Yeah, well, I think when we aim for perfection, first we all know Jesus is the only perfect one. And so we're never going to get there. So we're always going to disappoint ourselves when we're aiming for perfection. I think when we are seeking perfection, we also don't allow the fear, we don't allow failure to be an option, which then makes us crumble.

when we fail or make a mistake. I think for me, realizing the difference between excellence and perfection was the game changer. And I always say that the chasm is as wide as the Grand Canyon because we are to call them reminded of Colossians 3.23, whatever you do, do your work heartily is for the Lord. I want to do everything that I do with excellence.

Sarah Wildman (30:44.492)
Hmm.

lisa (31:01.078)
But it needs to stop there because when I start trying to push it to perfection, I'm going to stress myself. I am going to aggravate whoever's around me, whether it's my husband and my kids or the people that I am working with because it's not achievable. So remembering to seek excellence when those perfectionistic tentacles rise up has been the best antidote for me.

Sarah Wildman (31:30.249)
It's really helpful.

Becky Harling (31:30.967)
Man, we could go on with you, Lisa, probably for another hour. I can think of so many more topics. I realize that we are out of time and I'm wondering, I mean, moms, I hope that you have listened, that you've taken notes. You can go back and relisten and take more notes because there's been so much practical advice from our friend, Lisa. The whole juggling the ball concept.

letting go of self-criticism, letting go of perfectionism, figuring out what God's called you to do and with your husband or your spouse, obviously, and then really letting go of the other voices so that you don't get all wrapped up in guilt and shame and all of that. Lisa, I'm wondering, could you just

flows us out in prayer and just pray for our moms because you mentioned that you're coming up on 40 years and it takes a long time to learn some of these lessons. And I'm thinking about the moms that are right in the thick of it right now who think, my wash is never going to get folded again. I'm never going to be able to find matching socks.

I do have this assignment due for work and I want my child to feel loved. Could you pray for those moms right now?

lisa (32:53.694)
Absolutely. Lord Jesus, we thank you that we can come to you, Lord, that you are sovereign over all. You know our fears, you know our failures, and yet you love all of us. You love everything about us. You made us uniquely and you have wired us with different gifts and talent. I ask, Lord, that everyone that is listening, Lord, would feel your love and would feel empowered

to move forward in the purpose and passion that you have given to each of us, Lord. Let us put you as our top priority, Lord, and make a habit of starting our days with you and asking you to guide our days as they relate to our priorities. Lord, you took all of our guilt and shame. Let us leave it with you.

and not continue to carry it around because it's not a burden meant for us to carry. We love you, we thank you, you are all worthy, you are all knowing, and Lord, we cannot praise you enough. It's in Jesus' name that we pray, amen.

Becky Harling (33:50.408)
Mmm.

Becky Harling (34:09.811)
Amen. Hey friends, I really want to encourage you, especially if you are working outside the home and trying to keep everything in the air and well balanced, get Lisa's book. It's called Remember Who You Are, Achieve Success, Create Balance, Experience Fulfillment. Lisa co-authored it with Paula Brown Stafford and I...

know that you can find it wherever books are sold. So make sure you order her book and hey Lisa, if they want to get in touch with you for coaching, how do they find you?

lisa (34:44.559)
www.haberjohn.com that's H-A-B-E-R-G-E-O-N www.haberjohn.com and it will come in to someone who will reach out to me.

Becky Harling (34:55.91)
Okay, and.

Becky Harling (35:01.843)
And we'll put that in the show notes. Hey, friends, we want to thank you for joining us today for the Connected Mom podcast. And I want to encourage you to join us again next week where we'll have another conversation that will help you connect more deeply with God, more empathically with your fellow moms, and more intentionally with your child. And hey, if you like us, please subscribe to our channel.

when you log into your favorite podcast app, you'll never miss another episode of the Connected Mom podcast. So we hope you'll join us again next week. Thanks for joining us today.